▷S2E3 Mesa by Mesa: Advice from Diné Artist Elmer Yazzie

English

Oct 20

Rose Thomas reports from a month on the road for Modo di Bere, a trip that’s taking her from Texas to New Mexico to Italy. After sharing a phrase from Salerno that she was taught by winemaker Silvia Imparato, RT relays similar advice from Elmer Yazzie, an artist and teacher who recently organized the third annual Indigenous People’s Day Trail Ride in New Mexico and the Navajo Nation.
Elmer’s full interview will be published later on the Modo di Bere YouTube channel. Wherever this week takes you, don't forget to look around.

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Welcome to Modo di Bere, the podcast about local drinks and local sayings. I'm your host, Rose Thomas Bannister. Today I have edition of Modo di Bere for you. It's a little bit shorter, but a lot of fun. We'll be back next week with another interview, another great interview. And this week I'm recording from Verona in northern Italy, the land of Valpolicella, the land of Suave, the land of Prosecco. And I'm in Verona because every spring there is a gigantic, enormous, wonderful Italian wine fair for a few days at the end of March beginning of April and I have some tips for you today what I learned at Benitoly, how to enjoy this wine fair in particular, but also how to enjoy other wine fairs that you may get the chance to attend. So let's get right into it. I've got a local saying from Italy for you, that helped me get through the experience of getting taxis in Verona during Vinitali Week. And that phrase is "Una Gatta Fretolosa Fa 'i Gattini Chechi." That means a stressed cat gives birth to blind kittens. Now, I think that the true equivalent of this phrase in English would be Haste makes waste. Like, don't rush. You'll get a bad result. You'll make bad work. But I actually choose to interpret it a little bit differently for myself. I think I misunderstood it maybe the first time I heard it and just made it apply to something more that I've observed in Italian culture, which is, you know, just like, don't get too stressed out. It's not going to help. I think that helps when I'm traveling and why am I bringing up this phrase with getting taxis in Verona? So a lot of times when I'm doing wine visits in Italy or other places, I've got to rent a car because it's hard to make vineyard visits without that, but here in Verona, I just thought, well, I'll get some taxis and I'm staying a little, I've been staying a little bit outside of the city center. So First day, I'm calling a cab taxi company. No answer. I'm using a ride -hailing app No cabs are available So basically what I learned is the way that you get a cab in Verona during Venetali week when they're all busy is there are certain taxi stands in You know prominent areas the ones I know about are in Piazza Bra. There's two main beautiful piazzas in this amazing ancient city. One is Piazza Erbe, where a lot of people gather. It's very beautiful for a little aperitivo after Vinitili. And then the other one is Piazza Bra. Same thing. Also, people are getting a drink. It's a little bit bigger. There's a historic arena there, and there is So a taxi stand, and they wear people to stand in line and the taxis come by and you get in the taxi, but I guess you're not supposed to hail the cabs when you see them on the street, like I'm used to in New York City, you stand in line at the taxi stand. They have a taxi stand at the fairgrounds as well, but if you can plan your stay so that you can take advantage of the buses, that can be really good. Now, however, there's more than one kind of bus. There are the Navetta, which is the bus that takes you to the fairground and shuttles you between the fairground and Piazza Bra, at least that's what the Navetta does during the fair. I don't know about other times. I've only been to Verona during Vignitoli season, but the regular buses I found, I thought I was going to be okay because I stayed on a bus line and that can be a good way to do it. But this bus also just was behind schedule and not coming. I only caught it once. It felt like an absolute miracle. I asked the taxi driver, I'm sorry, the bus driver to tell me when the stop was to get out of the fare. I think I was a little overconfident in my Italian. At that moment, he didn't tell me or I didn't understand when he tried to tell me. Ended up at the end of the line And I said, "Oh gosh, did I miss the fairground?" And he said, "Yes, but we'll leave again in 10 minutes and then I'll take you there." He was having a little coffee, a little cigarette, a little bathroom break. Anyway, I looked so sad. He'd just asked me to join him. He bought me a coffee. He was from Sicily. He taught me how to say, "Let's go on Diamo in Sicilian." I think it was a special bus driver version, let's go, we're late. And then, you know, I got back on the bus and I made it to my destination. But what I would say is just plan ahead if you're gonna stay outside with not within walking distance of those shuttle buses, which is your best bet for transport to and from the fare, then I would make sure you stay on a bus line but leave plenty of extra time for the buses to pick you up and don't count on being able to call on a cab to get there. You can stand in a taxi line once you're in the city center or at the fairgrounds to take you back to your place that you're staying but to get there you got to be on a bus line or just walk. Stay within walking distance of the city center of Piazza Bra pick up the shuttle bus. So that was my most important thing that I learned for attending this wine fair. Yeah, vinitilli, I maybe should have said at the beginning, but vinitilli, they have a couple of days where you can just attend as a wine lover. You don't have to have a professional affiliation. You can pay to attend. And then the rest of the days is more wine business, importers, you know, this kind of thing. So it's really fun. I really recommend it. And if you do attend this wine fair and also any other wine tasting, any industry tasting or whether you're professional or not, if you've never been to a wine fair before, is even if you're just getting started in the industry, for whatever reason, it's your first wine fair or one of your first wine fairs. I have an important thing to tell you about which is spitting in Italian. The word for spittoon is Sputakiera and it is what you use to spew the wine that you've tasted from your mouth because if you get drunk in the first 10 minutes because you're swallowing the wine, which will happen if you're tasting a bunch of wines, then that's it for you. You're not tasting any wine for the rest of the day. You might have a fun time but you're not going to be able to have your sensory capacity, your memory, and everything with you. And if you really think that you're going to taste all the wines and it's just not safe, you really got to spit. Now, the reason I'm bringing this up, it seems obvious, right? When you think about it, but I found it was really hard, something that was really hard for me to learn because it feels counterintuitive. So you're wasting beautiful wine, right? You're not wasting it right because you're tasting it they want you to taste it that's what they're there for so try to remember you're not wasting the wine by spitting it out to taste it is the purpose of the event just to taste and the the other thing that feels counterintuitive we're difficult about it is it's kind of gross right it's it's a weird thing to get used to and then I have to say vinita lee it's it's busy it's bustling New York wine fairs are so much more crowded. It's actually wonderful that they have glasses for you at each of the stands. They have these big stands and some littler ones where they have kind of everything they need to teach you the wine. You don't have to carry your wine glass around. I like that it's less crowded than New York wine fairs. I like that I don't have to carry my glass around. There's a little more space, but you still times have to be very assertive to get to that spit bucket. And so here you are, you know, maybe you're new with this, you know, maybe you're in another country, you know, you, you know, you need to spit, but there you are. It's hard for you to spit out this beautiful thing feels wasteful. It feels gross. And then you have to push your way towards the spit bucket. So you have to be assertive. I have a funny thing that I think helps if you're just getting used to this it's kind of silly but I like it just pretend that you have a very curse on you so that you know at lunchtime you can swallow your wine at dinnertime you can swallow your wine at a baritibo you can swallow your your apparel spritz or whatever spritz you like but during the time at the wine fair, it's like, I don't know, kryptonite, poison. Like you can taste the wine and enjoy it, but if you swallow it, that's it for you. You've fallen into the fairy lands and not the nice kind. So that's something that helps me as far as getting to that spit bucket. Listen, just take up space, go, use little nonverbal communication. You've got wine in your mouth, I need to get to the spit it. Sometimes they have little handles. You can grab it and bring it towards yourself. It's weird at first, but it is worth it. And I have a phrase for you from Milan that I love that people don't necessarily use in other parts of Italy. It's grande, spingy. So grande is just kind of a greeting like a nice complimentary general nickname like kind of like hey hey guy hey friend grande you know like big great great you're great I love it it's a great nickname so it's kind of a hey you and then Spingy means like go for it it means push I said this to a friend from Amelia Ramon yet once and she said no we don't say that it sounds like you're pushing out a baby that's so funny but in Milan which is you know very business -y place maybe you Well, they say, okay, push, go for it, push. So grande, spingy, get there, get that spit bucket. That's for you, that's what you're supposed to do, just go for it. And pretty soon, it'll feel like second nature. The other thing I wanted to talk to you about was seeing everything, learning everything. Let me give you a secret. In wine in general, but especially in Italy, you can't see everything. You can't learn everything, there's too much. No one could do it. And again, even if you could learn everyone in Italy, which there's hundreds of different grapes, that's the fun, it would change the next year because every vintage is a different vintage. (gentle music) So, just jump in the pool, get started, learn a little bit. I would say trying to visit every pavilion because each region of Italy, each wine region, of which there are 20, has a giant building devoted just to that region. So there just isn't enough time, especially if you have some master classes that you want to go to. There's some great events to attend. I would say pick a really focused goal, a few things that you really want to learn, that you really want to taste, and just stick with that. The other thing is that you, someone told me the first time I came to this fair, which was really helpful to me, is that you have to make appointments. Now, you don't always have to make an appointment, but it's really helpful. You don't want to find your way to a producer that you really want to taste, only to find out that they're there at a business meeting with their importer or something, and the, you know, they don't have time to taste with you. If there's something that you really need to see that you really need to taste, there's an app that with all the exhibitors, It gives you their email. You can email them make an appointment with them Hopefully not the day before the fair a little advanced notice is great And then you'll know that you'll get to taste that wine that you really want to taste now. It's good I think also to Spend some time also wondering around I had a really great time at the micro mega tent this is a of the smaller producers at little or tense, great energy actually found that when sort of traditional Viniciusly was kind of winding down around four o 'clock, there's still rockin' and rollin' in the micromegatent. They're small, organic producers, especially ones that make wine from obscure grapes that maybe need to be rescued and revitalized in order to keep them from falling out of being planted at all. I loved the micro megatint. That was really fun. I met some great producers there. Things like the Vinny Sola producer from the island of Pantilleria. I discovered their wines. They were amazing. I had had Zibibo, the grapes they make there from Sicily, but not from Pantilleria really. Maybe I'd had a Vecito once or twice. I am making dry ones. They're making sparkling wines from Zibibo, which is a really interesting grape. I thought their wines were amazing. That was a discovery that I made. And also the Tatsulenge team, that's a really rare grape from Friuli with a lot of tannins. That's, it's called the tongue cutter. That's the translation of the local name. So I got to meet some, a person there who is representing a team of growers who make Tatsulenge or the Nishita team that is a white grape from Piedmont that is being revitalized with a group of producers. So micro megatents really fun, great energy, almost like a fermentation vibe, just bubbling way in there. So you know, that was a great spot to wander around. So it's not that you have to have appointments for every single thing. Try to keep a balance of, okay, I want to attend a masterclass, I want to make some specific appointments and then I want to have some time to just see where the fair takes me, discover some things that are new to me. So that's my advice for appointments. And I do have a saying for that that has been repeated to me. It's almost a category of sayings. Actually, I learned some new versions of it this this trip to Italy. And this is kind of a funny one. It's when you want to have everything, but actually, you can't because it's not possible. And that is someone Someone wants Bota Piena and La Molie Uriaca. So somebody wants the full wine barrel and the drunk wife. So I think this is hilarious. You know what, you've got your happy wife. She's enjoying herself, but also the barrel's full. No, you can't have both, so you can't do it all. Just accept that and do what you can and you'll have a great time. And so another thing I want to speak to you is about equilibrio balance. And so for yourself, this is a big busy fair. You can hear in my voice, I've talked a lot, I've talked to a lot of people, it can be taxing on your health, not just because, you know, you're trying to spit out this alcohol, but because it's you've traveled, it's a long day, maybe a long night. So just take care of yourself, slow down, don't be macho. I know that here at Moto De Berry I've taught you several different sayings about not drinking water, that whining out here. Obviously this is a joke, it's a metaphor for enjoying your life. Drink water, if you need some water you can ask someone that you're tasting with "hey can I have some water?" They're gonna have that there for you. Wear comfortable shoes, feed yourself. Take some time. You don't want to get sick. Just pace yourself. When you have these busy weeks in wine, a lot of food, a lot of wine in the evening, maybe just really think about what your purpose is. What your purpose is there. For me, it's always to make friends, to sell stories, and to learn. The best way that I can learn is if I'm feeling good, if I'm feeling strong. It's just wonderful to be traveling here. They've beautiful sandwiches, just the most beautiful sandwiches every time I have one. I just feel like I'm revived. So take some time, wear comfortable shoes, the most fashionable, amazing women in wine that I know in Italy who I'm sure have a lot of fancy shoes. We're all wearing big boots. You know, maybe a platform boot, maybe a little dazzle on the boot, but a boot, okay? So take care of yourself. And so that's the word for, in wine as well. Equilibrial. Things are unequilibrio. That's a little wine tasting term for you. Speaking of shoes, a little note about packing. I got some great advice from a friend of mine. It went the first time I came to this fair. He told me about the appointments. You know, he told me about dinner reservations. That can be difficult. Although there are a lot of restaurants in Verona. Some of the hottest places, it's gonna be hard hard to get into if you don't have an event that you're part of or made reservations in advance. But just just wander around a little bit. You'll find something to eat. Don't worry, Italians want everyone to get something to eat. But my friend was a guy and didn't necessarily talk to me about packing. So it's a fun, fun week. There's symphony concerts going on. There's different kinds of parties. You know, it's just really lovely. And also it's a springtime and the weather can change a lot from day to night as a part of why at least such a great place to make wine because you have what we call a diurnal shift which helps the grapes maintain their acidity as they ripen. We had some sunny beautiful days here and some kind of chilly nights and mornings this week. There was also one day where there was a big rainstorm with a little bit of hail because everyone's thinking about their vines back home. You know, oh no, there's some hail. I hope that's not happening to my vineyard. Bring an umbrella, bring some layers, bring some outfits for some different occasions. You never know what kind of adventure you're gonna have. And since I did get caught in the rain, the umbrella that I brought across the ocean with me, I did not bring with me that day. It was fine. I made friends with someone else with an umbrella. Everybody kind of huddled together and enjoyed discussing the weather under an awning. There's a cute phrase that I like about rain that I learned in Italian, which is "piove sul barriato." It rains on the wet. I think that's really funny. We say in English when it rains it pours, but I like the one in Italian even better. So try to be prepared. Try to pack for everything light but with layers and different levels of dressiness so that you can be ready for anything. Thank you so much for listening to this special edition of "Motordy Berry" with my scratchy voice. I really hope that you liked it. I hope that you learned something. I always have more to learn. That's just the truth of it. I learned some things this week. You know, maybe you know some of this already, but maybe some of it's helpful. I hope so. You can tell me what you think of this episode and anything else you've heard or seen on the MotoDBerry podcast, the MotoDBerry YouTube channel, MotoDBerry Instagram and TikTok. There's a lot of great content there. More happening all the time. So much things that I have gathered and learned in Italy this this trip that I cannot wait to share with you. So if there's something that you like. Tell me how you like the show. Tell me if there's something that you want me to cover. Tell me if there's a local drink or a local saying that you think that our listeners should know about. You can send me an email at my website, motoduberry .com, send me a message on Instagram that can follow me @motoduberry. There's also a Facebook page. Just get in there, follow the show and I really appreciate it. I really appreciate everybody who's listening. Yeah, go to Vinitili, it's really fun, or go to a wine fair near you. Hopefully this advice was helpful to you. You can become a supporter of the show if you love it, if you wanna continue to grow at our Patreon. You can also find a link to that on my website, MotoDBerry .com. Wherever you go and whatever you like to drink, always remember to enjoy your life and to never stop learning. Thanks again and see you next week with another interview. Follow Motodiberia on YouTube, Instagram, and TikTok for even more unique and encouraging drinks and language content. If you'd love for the show to continue and grow, support Motodiberia on Patreon and unlock bonus episodes. Find out more at motoduberia .com, where you can also read the blog. Music for the podcast was composed by Ercilia Prosperi and performed by the band OU. You can purchase their recordings at oumusic .bandcamp .com. Engañándose, déjase para sí mismo